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PEELOUTS CORNER

Most people who know me understand that I love debate on controversial subjects. In this thread, I'm going to bring up topics or make statements that I think would stir up some debate. Too me, debate is a very positive thing. While hearing things we don't agree with probably will not change our thoughts instantly, it will give us something to think about that can affect our beliefs in the future.

When reading what I write, please remember that the only thing I have complete confidence in is my ability to be wrong. So don't be shy about voiceing your opinion, but don't be offended if you get rebuttal.

And remember, I've been known to take a side I don't necessarily agree with for the pure joy of fostering further debate.


Wed. Jan 29, 7:21am

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Werewolf diet

Are you kidding me? Losing wt based on lunar cycles? Will we never stop searching for magic bullets? This is shear craziness.

From an article I read:
"Unlike the Paleo diet, which encourages you to eat like a cave man, the so-called Werewolf Diet doesn’t actually involve having the bloodlust of werewolves. But it is based on the cycles of the moon, and it’s the latest eating craze among some celebrities.

The idea is that the moon influences the water in our bodies in the same way that it impacts the tides of the ocean. According to the website Moon Connection, humans are made up of a lot of water (which is true), and when the moon is full or at a new phase, there’s a gravitational pull that can last for 24 hours and affect how much water weight you can gain or lose (questionable). Dieters can follow two plans, the basic moon diet plan and the extended version. The basic version is a 24-hour day of fasting in which you only drink water and juice during the full moon or new moon. That supposedly cleanses your body of toxins, and the website says you can lose up to six pounds of water weight that day (highly unlikely).
Read more: Werewolf diet: promising the moon | TIME.com http://healthland.time.com/2014/01/28/promising-the-moon-the-truth-behind-the-werewolf-diet/#ixzz2rn0hbZz6"

My belief: Eliminating crap is the only proven method of losing wt. Exercise will help after that. It's not rocket science.

Wednesday, January 29, 2014, 7:26 AM

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Sorry to disappoint you, but I have to agree with you. This is one of the most ridiculous things I've heard. I thought it was a joke when I read the title.

Wednesday, January 29, 2014, 2:47 PM

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what howling at the moon.. shredding off my clothes wont make me skinnier.. im so disappointed lol- oh it suppose to be the phases of the moon that will make me lose weight.. and here i was thinking it was what i put in my body and how i moved my body.. silly me.. magic bullets are for guns not for health and wellness.
just my opinion .. i could be wrong, but the 207 pounds i have released says i may be doing something right..

really people own your choices stop looking for a magic bullet,, be you own magic bullet.. put in the effort..do what it takes to reach your goals

lynneta6

Wednesday, January 29, 2014, 3:19 PM

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MYTH: Calories consumed - calories burnt = wt loss/gain

OK, the Werewolf diet was too easy, but it was just something I saw today on the news and found entertaining. Here's a better one.

Statement:
The theory that you will lose wt if the amount of calories burnt is more than the amount consumed (per day) is a myth.
My reasoning::
1. If you currently eat 1300 cals/day of healthy foods, then change to 1200 cals/day of snickers bars, and keep the exact same lifestyle and exercise routines, you will gain wt despite the fact that you reduced your cals. I've never tested that but I believe it to be true.
2. People who exercise should gain muscle from the exercise. Muscle burns more than fat. Therefore, there metabolisms should increase as they lose wt if they are exercising while they lose. Since their metabolisms are improving, therefore their calorie expenditure throughout the day is increasing (due to increased muscle), once they have reduced calories to the point where they start losing, they should never stop losing. They would never hit a plateau because their muscle mass is increasing which steadily improves their metabolism.

Wednesday, January 29, 2014, 9:38 PM

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I don't even get this thread.

Thursday, January 30, 2014, 9:47 AM

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Its just something I started to get people to think. I post a question or comment that is either controversial or just something new I saw. People can comment differing opinons or just ignore it.
Peelout

Thursday, January 30, 2014, 10:08 AM

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KID'S PE CLASSES

I've noticed a big change in PE since I was a kid (I'm 54 now), especially girls PE. Now even in my time, PE for girls was different than for boys. Girls had archery and badminton. Boys mostly played games where they threw balls at each other. Many PE teachers today think the class needs to be much more than getting a good 45min of exercise. It must be a full mind/body/spirit experience (seems more true for my daughters teachers than my sons). But even in my sons PE class, there is less emphasis on just getting in 45min of enjoyable exercise and more emphasis on structured things.

I'm not sure I agree with this. Here are some examples:
1. During 1 school yr, my daughters PE teacher felt it was important to learn the rules of every sport that they spent about 3wks each on. During tennis, they had to learn all the terminology and rules, and had home work and tests. Same with bowling, volley ball, and others.
2. Many teachers require a lot of running and the kids have to wear heart rate monitors and stay above percentiles. They are graded on that.
3. They had archery, which I don't even think of as a physical sport. One does not develop significant muscle or raise the HR doing archery.

Maybe I'm just old fashioned. But I know my daughter hated the year she had testing and was scored on how competitive she was in the sports. To me, the purpose of grade school and high school PE is:
a) Burn off some energy so they can concentrate on academic classes and not be aggressive during the rest of the day.
b) Burn some calories and get some general fitness
c) Just have fun so they develop a love of being active. I think I had a total of 1 test my entire 4yrs of high school PE. I learned the basics of volley ball, football, baseball, etc, but wasn't graded on all the terminology. We just exercised hard and looked forward to it. Today, I'm very active in my sports (wall climbing and ww kayaking and exercising). PE in HS wasn't regimented, we just gave it hell and were tired when we were done.

I wonder if todays regimented classes really instill a love of exercise. I occasionally play tennis. I barely know the rules, but I just like to get out and try it. I don't know all the basketball rules, but I occasionally like to shoot some hoops. Point is, I don't have to know all the rules just to have some fun with it.

My take:
HS PE should be more about just getting the kids to be active (PE is about the only exercise the majority seem to get these days) and letting them have some fun and burn off energy. If they find a sport they like, they will learn the rules on their own.

Whats your thought?

Thursday, January 30, 2014, 9:47 PM

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So what am I commenting about here?

Friday, January 31, 2014, 2:08 PM

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It's. finding a sport you like and can have fun with can make it not boring. My children's p e classes are really great. They mix it up every day and they always say its their favorite subject.

Friday, January 31, 2014, 5:58 PM

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I think you WILL lose weight eating crap if you consistently eat less crap than you need. There is much more to be gained by eating healthful food, but if someone ONLY ate 1200 calories and they routinely burned a lot more than that over time - they WILL lose weight. More likely people who eat crappola rebound and over eat b/c they're hungry. 1200 in candy bars and crap is not a lot of food. People are not just eating 1200 in empty calories and calling it a day.

And people don't just gain muscle from the average work out. I base this on - the level of effort I see at the gym, input from people who work with athletes and talk about what it takes to truly build muscle, and personal experience (only did cardio in my 20's and didn't have ANY muscle!).

I believe the sentiment that bodies do not plateau - people and their consistency and their diligence plateau. They think they're exercising enough, but they're not as they start to exercise a little less, a little less vigorously, with less variety. They think they're watching what they eat, but they start to routinely justify why they can have just a little of this and a little of that - no longer exercising and eating how they were to lose weight. Then they claim the weigh gain is muscle or their bodies have plateaued.

I also don't believe that something is true for every single human being. I believe that these things are true for most people, but I'm sure there are exceptions out there - just not the vast majority who think so!

january 30 - I believe adults are ruining about everything out there related to kids, sports/activity, and fun!

Sunday, February 02, 2014, 2:31 PM

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I'm just going to vent about cell phones tonight. Tonight some moron sat on a machine at the gym I wanted to use and texted. I went about my other exercises, did 3 sets of curls, and 2 ab exercises and he was still texting. Finally I just went over a with a look of "your an idiot", I asked if I could slip in a set. He got up knowing what I was thinking. Leave the d@m cell phones in your locker or just don't respond if its not an emergency. Same goes for going to movies. I put mine on vibrate if I absolutely must stay in touch for an emergency. Why do so many people think they have to be in touch every minute of the day and lose all sense of courtesy?

Wednesday, February 05, 2014, 9:58 PM

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I like this thread!

-Habib

Friday, February 21, 2014, 8:46 AM

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Me too. No one gets how rude it is to check their cell all the time.

Friday, February 21, 2014, 9:48 AM

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Politics

I was having a discussion about politics (my favorite topic to debate) w/ a friend at work today. I always love to discuss topics w/ those who have opposing views, as my friend does. It wasn't much of a debate since we both agreed that we see nothing on the horizon to get excited about for 2016. Things we agreed on:
1. How can Congress not vote to get rid of the penny? It cost more to make than its worth. An overwhelming majority don't want it. But Congress cant come to a decision on something as simple as that.
2. Why do we still have 6 day a week mail? I get maybe 10 useful pieces of mail a week and none of them are so urgent I could not wait an extra day on (and I don't even pay bills online).

I'd wager that a vote by the public would get >90% in favor of cutting to 5 day mail and getting rid of the penny. Yet Congress can't even do that.

Sorry, I had to vent about something. Its day 2 w/o nicotene. Man, I hate being a junky. Its strange to think I can poison myself w/ nicotene (and all the other drugs that come with it) legally.

Thursday, March 06, 2014, 8:33 PM

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Hooray on two days off cigs!!!!! and yes congress is often totally lame - don't know how they keep their jobs

Friday, March 07, 2014, 5:40 PM

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Late weighing in on the PE question:

We couldn't go outside a lot of the year for PE (weather) so we learned dancing! Contra-dancing, square dancing, a little swing... ...my K-12 PE classes have sure come in handy later in life! I definitely am not against kids actually learning something in PE.

Who knows, your kid who didn't like learning the rules of tennis in middle school might find herself suddenly thrown into a conversation about Wimbledon with the cutest guy in her college class (It happened to me!) and be very glad of the knowledge.

Saturday, March 08, 2014, 5:30 PM

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still off the cigs?? You can do it!

Monday, March 10, 2014, 1:56 PM

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PP. Yep.

Monday, March 10, 2014, 9:39 PM

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Hooray .............hoofrickinray.......four days off cigs and counting........hooray for peelout!!!!!!!!!

Tuesday, March 11, 2014, 2:48 PM

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Absolutely awesome - peel... you can do it!

Thursday, March 13, 2014, 1:50 PM

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Annoyances of the day

So I read an article today about 2 girls 18 and 15 who were arrested for making an autistic boy perform sex acts (some w/ animals), kicking him in the groin, and making him walk on thin ice till he fell in the water. This was over several periods. How freaking depraved can the world get? And where were the parents (of both)?

I also read of how the Senate is investigating the CIA and claims the CIA is spying on the Senate computers over waterboarding that occurred 5 yrs ago and the CIA is claiming the Senate stole classified material from the CIA. I'm not going to debate whether waterboarding is right or not nor am I particularly interested in who is stealing/spying from whom. What kills me is that an investigation in waterboarding is taking 5yrs. Really? 5yrs? How slow can these people possibly move? I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but some times I still am. I mean, this is a country where Michelle Bachmann was a contender for president (you won't hurt my feelings if you have a rebuttal on that cause arguing over who is the best politician anymore is like arguing over which is the best turd in a giant cesspool). Theres only 1 politician I really like. I would have voted for him for president if it wasn't for his nutcase partner. I won't say who that was, cause its whole other story.

Thursday, March 13, 2014, 10:00 PM

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About scales, wt gain, and muscle

My thoughts on scales and the notion that you can't trust them cause an increase in wt could be muscle growth. When I'm trying to lose, I weigh daily. I want daily feedback, but I realize there is going to be noise in the data. The scale is just a tool, no different that calipers or tape measure.

I disagree w/ the notion that muscle growth is going to be a significant factor in wt gain for the average person of a period of less than several months. Muscle growth is dependent on several factors:
1. Genetics
2. Sex (that's male or female). Don't mean to be unPC, but men develop muscle faster and in greater quantity than women (in general).
3. Type of w/o. Muscle growth occurs when you try to push the muscle past its limit. Lifting tears the muscle down, and the body responds by trying to make it stronger. If you aren't doing a w/o geared toward growth, you will not gain a lot of muscle size. Continually increasing reps of any exercise is great for burning calories, building strength, and increasing cardio. However, it does little for muscle growth. You will gain strength, and you will shed fat that covers the muscle, but you will not get significant growth.
4. How you feed the muscle.
5. Age (as you age, it gets more difficult to gain muscle)

Don't confuse feeling firmer, or having your muscle show more with growth. Removing the fat covering the muscle will make the muscle look bigger, and feel firmer, but that's only cause its been covered up.

An increase in strength also does not necessarily mean an increase in muscle size. Increases in percieved strength come from 3 things:
1. The body naturally tries to do things using the least effort. You become more efficient at doing something as you practice it. The body finds the best speed to perform the exercise, the best body position, etc.
2. The body starts using more of the muscle fibers. A muscle is not a single entity. It is comprised of fibers. The more fibers the body can get to "fire up", the more it can lift. As you lift wts, the body starts using more fibers of the muscles. That is an increase in strength, not muscle size.
3. The last reason, and the hardest to get, is because of actual muscle growth. A gain of 1lb of real muscle a month is a very significant feet for most people (I'm excluding young, genetically predispositioned, males, who pump iron). For the average person trying to gain muscle, 1lb/month is a lot.

So if you want to stop using scales and use tape measures, fine. Tapes are tools too, just much less convenient, very dependent on how tight you pull them and exactly how you hold your body, and the pace of the changes you will measure won't allow you to see if you are headed in the right direction for a much longer period than a scale will.

In short, if you are gaining wt, you are probably not gaining muscle size. You are either gaining fat or gaining water. That's why you have to think in terms of trend lines, and not daily fluctuations.

As always, I love rebuttal and am very confident in my ability to be wrong.

Friday, March 14, 2014, 11:42 PM

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Scales, wt gain, and muscle growth

My thoughts on scales and the notion that you can't trust them cause an increase in wt could be muscle growth. When I'm trying to lose, I weigh daily. I want daily feedback, but I realize there is going to be noise in the data. The scale is just a tool, no different that calipers or tape measure.

I disagree w/ the notion that muscle growth is going to be a significant factor in wt gain for the average person of a period of less than several months. Muscle growth is dependent on several factors:
1. Genetics
2. Sex (that's male or female). Don't mean to be unPC, but men develop muscle faster and in greater quantity than women (in general).
3. Type of w/o. Muscle growth occurs when you try to push the muscle past its limit. Lifting tears the muscle down, and the body responds by trying to make it stronger. If you aren't doing a w/o geared toward growth, you will not gain a lot of muscle size. Continually increasing reps of any exercise is great for burning calories, building strength, and increasing cardio. However, it does little for muscle growth. You will gain strength, and you will shed fat that covers the muscle, but you will not get significant growth.
4. How you feed the muscle.
5. Age (as you age, it gets more difficult to gain muscle)

Don't confuse feeling firmer, or having your muscle show more with growth. Removing the fat covering the muscle will make the muscle look bigger, and feel firmer, but that's only cause its been covered up.

An increase in strength also does not necessarily mean an increase in muscle size. Increases in percieved strength come from 3 things:
1. The body naturally tries to do things using the least effort. You become more efficient at doing something as you practice it. The body finds the best speed to perform the exercise, the best body position, etc.
2. The body starts using more of the muscle fibers. A muscle is not a single entity. It is comprised of fibers. The more fibers the body can get to "fire up", the more it can lift. As you lift wts, the body starts using more fibers of the muscles. That is an increase in strength, not muscle size.
3. The last reason, and the hardest to get, is because of actual muscle growth. A gain of 1lb of real muscle a month is a very significant feet for most people (I'm excluding young, genetically predispositioned, males, who pump iron). For the average person trying to gain muscle, 1lb/month is a lot.

So if you want to stop using scales and use tape measures, fine. Tapes are tools too, just much less convenient, very dependent on how tight you pull them and exactly how you hold your body, and the pace of the changes you will measure won't allow you to see if you are headed in the right direction for a much longer period than a scale will.

In short, if you are gaining wt, you are probably not gaining muscle size. You are either gaining fat or gaining water. That's why you have to think in terms of trend lines, and not daily fluctuations.

As always, I love rebuttal and am very confident in my ability to be wrong.

Friday, March 14, 2014, 11:43 PM

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More on the topic in the previous post.

This is a followup to my previous post.

From: http://www.aworkoutroutine.com/how-much-muscle-can-you-gain/

•Average Natural MAN: between 0.25 and 0.5 pounds of muscle per week (or about 1-2 pounds of muscle gained per month).
•Average Natural WOMAN: between 0.12 – 0.25 pounds of muscle per week (or about 0.5-1 pound of muscle gained per month).

Of course you can get a wide range of answers on the web. Go to a bodybuilding site that sells supplements and it will say a large number. But that's just so that when you don't gain that much, you will buy some supplements.

Point is, the scale is a very useful tool for understanding if you are losing or gaining wt. It will not tell you if the wt is from water, fat, or muscle. Your eyes will tell you if you need to lose fat. If the eyes say you need to lose fat, then the scale is a very good indicator of fat gain/loss as long as you look at a trend line. Water will fluctuate only so much. If you look at at your wt trend over a one month period and your wt went up, it is most likely due to either fat or water gain, not muscle gain (especially if you are in several of the following categories: a woman, any sex not genetically predispositioned toward muscle growth, 35+ yrs old, not performing a w/o specifically geared toward muscle growth, not feeding the muscle sufficient protein).

What is a w/o that builds muscle? A muscle growth w/o is one where you keep trying to lift heavier amounts. For example, a typical chest muscle growth w/o will include something like this:
Set 1 - 10 reps of a moderate (40% of your 1 rep max) wt as a warmup.
Set 2- 8 reps using about 60% of your 1 rep max.
Set 3 - The max wt you can lift 5-7 times. You keep going until you absolutely can not do another rep, but use a wt that gets you into the 5-7 rep range.
There are lots of variation on this, but its a basic guide. Even if you follow a routine like this, you aren't guaranteed muscle growth. The other factors above can still inhibit muscle growth (remember, growth and strength are not the same thing).

A w/o where you do lots of reps on a single set will not promote growth. A w/o where you do 3 sets of 10 reps with the same wt will not promote growth either. These routines will burn fat, increase cardio, firm the muscle, can slow the loss of muscle that occurs as we age, and have general fitness benefits. Its great for many reasons, but muscle growth is not one of them.

Just my amateur opinion.


Saturday, March 15, 2014, 5:01 PM

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Another followup:
Here are a couple more reasons I think only a specific type w/o will cause muscle growth for most people except those who have several of the high growth factors mentioned above.

Look at long distance runners. Even though they run for years, the ones I've seen do not have large muscles. There legs have a great deal of definition, but never due I see large thigh muscles. And they work their legs a lot!. If all it took to get growth was working the muscle, long distance runners should all have bodybuilder thighs. Now contrast that with someone who does squats and other leg exercises using wt and focuses on continually trying to increase the wt. They develop size, but sometimes never the definition a runner gets.

Also look at the women who teach classes in my gym (some teach at least 7 classes a week). Some have been there for 5+ years. If all it takes is lots of working the muscle to gain a lb a month, these girls should have gained 60lbs of muscle. But they aren't that muscular. They are strong, well defined, and have a great deal of cardio ability. Now contrast that to some of the girls who lift wts seriously, 1 of which competes in bodybuilding competitions. We have about 4 who you can see are pushing to increase wt. Their bodies show signs of muscular growth. They also tend to have some of the other factors I mentioned above.

But just because general exercise that is not focused on achieving muscular growth doesn't cause growth (at least in my opinion) or because a person does not have enough of the factors to really get some growth, it doesn't mean there aren't reasons to exercise. I am 54 and not genetically inclined to develop muscular size. So why do I even bother?
Increase in strength
Increase in energy
Increase in flexibility
Increase in cardio
Increase in resistance to disease
Reduced fat

There are plenty of reasons to do any exercise program. But one must be realistic when it comes to muscular growth. A lb a month of muscular growth is a very high target.

And remember, I love other opinions. Its how we learn.
Peel

Saturday, March 15, 2014, 11:05 PM

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Peel out what is your height and weight and fitness level

Sunday, March 16, 2014, 11:05 AM

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5'10, currently 175lb, ideal would be 163, age 54, genetically inclined not to develop large muscles (thinner bone structure).
Fitness level is hard to define but I'll try:
I don't have any major health issues other than thyroid which a simple pill daily keeps totally in control of with no symptoms.
I have occasional issues with joint pain in my shoulders, but it decreases when I keep active at the gym.
I'm able to participate in white water kayaking, down hill skiing, and indoor wall climbing on a regular basis.
I'm an adrenaline junk.
Ex light smoker (12 days and counting)
I guess I would rank my self in the 70th-80th fitness percentile for people aged 54.

Sunday, March 16, 2014, 2:59 PM

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All: Don't think that just cause I write an opinion, that I think anyone else should agree with it. I wirte things in hope that people will give me rebuttals. I used to believe 2 things that I've changed my mind on based on rebuttals:
1. You can lose wt primarily through exercise. I now believe that diet is >80% of the battle, and exercise <20%. In fact, I believe most people can lose wt throught diet alone, but can't lose wt through exercise alone. However, I feel exercise is what makes you feel better.
2. Calories in - calories out decides wt loss. I now believe its the type of calories you consume is more important than the number of calories you consume.

I changed my mind on these based on rebuttals. But I requires solid reasoning to change my mind. Do what works for you, but be open minded to changing your philisophy based on reasoning.
Peelout

Monday, March 17, 2014, 8:28 AM

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Hi Peelout, this is Jackie and someone mentioned your thread in one of my groups. Calories in - calories out does not decide weight loss. This isn't meant to spark a debate. That statement has been proven to be wrong. 100 calories of swiss chard are a completely different nutritional profile than 100 calorie snack pack and nutrients are a key component to weight loss.

Monday, March 17, 2014, 1:03 PM

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Thanks Jackie. If calories in - calories out being less that 0 meant automatic wt loss, then a person who was maintaining there wt at 1400 calories could lose wt by eaating all candyas long as they reduced there calories (say eating six 200 calorie candy bars = 1200cals). I just can't believe you would lose wt eating 1200 cals of almost all sugar). Thats why I switched to the theory that it is the type of calories you eat that causes wt loss. Of course, people do lose wt by reducing calories, but its because they reduce the "crap" foods which are generally high in calories.

Monday, March 17, 2014, 8:04 PM

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Getting away from fitness and back to my favorite subject, politics:

Donald trump has made it official. He will not be running for govenor of NY. However, he has decided to do something bigger (although he did not say what). At least he is consistent. This is about the 6th election cycle where he has made it official that he will not be running for anything after spending 6 months insinuating that he might. Now all the Republican Presidential Candidates can start lining up to kiss his ring like they did in the last presidential election. The women have 2 people tied for goofiest polititian. For the men, I'd say Trump leads the pack, although I'm not sure you can call yourself a politician if all you ever do is announce you aren't running for something.

In case you are wondering, I have officially decided that I am not running for president in 2016. Although I may quit the job I was hired to do and go do lucrative book and speaking deals where all I do is complain and give folksy quips to people on the fringe. But thats another story.

Tuesday, March 18, 2014, 8:51 PM

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But you stated - it's simple, calories in - calories out determines weight loss. Did I miss the part where you mentioned the type of calories matter?

Wednesday, March 19, 2014, 10:18 AM

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I think there is some confusion in what I wrote.

Here is what I think you (and Jackie) are referring to:
"Calories in - calories out decides wt loss. I now believe its the type of calories you consume is more important than the number of calories you consume."


When I started with PT, I believed that Calories in - Calories out = wt loss/gain. If you burned more calories than you consumed, you would lose wt. I then said "I now believe...". Based on discussions with team members, debate, and reading some of the links people sent me, I changed my mind on this about a year ago and no longer believe it. I now believe the theory that high starch or high sugar calories cause an insulin spike in blood sugar. The body responds by storing the starch or sugar calorie as fat to lower the blood sugar level (the process is kind of interesting and you can find it by googling "a calorie is not a calorie". This is the basic premise of the ATKINS diet. I'm not a supporter of the ATKINS diet though because it eliminates nearly all carbs. Based on the theory I believe, high fiber carbs are slow acting and do not cause blood sugar spikes. You can eat tons of vegys and hi fiber fruits. Just stay away from crap (potatos, chips, donuts, candy, soda, etc).

I must not have been very clear several posts up cause it seems to have caused confusion. Sorry about that.

Incidently, notice I always say theory and not fact or proven. For any fitenss/diet fact thats been proven, I can come up with the opposite fact thats also been proven. Thats why I always say theory. Its the theory I believe based on my limited reasoning skills relative to the supporting evidence that I find logical.

Wednesday, March 19, 2014, 11:29 AM

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12lbs in 3wks?

I happened to notice the advertisement for the cheat system on here today. Seen it a million times, but the statement "Lose 12lbs in 3wks" struck me. Now I've read the cheat system, and like many systems, it will work cause it eliminates crap. Let me repeat that, I believe its a good system. However, the claim about 12lbs in 3wks seems a little over the top. I'm not saying it has never happened, but I would say its what the analytical call an "outlier". In the 2yrs I've been on here, I've yet to see anyone lose 12lbs in 3wks. The often touted 2lb's per week goal is something very few achieve especially with any consistency. 12lbs in 3wks is 4lbs per week. That is gi-normous. I have seen people on Biggest Loser show lose much more in a week, but you have to factor in the % of wt loss for them since they often way 300+lbs, the fact that they get to eat, sleep, and breath at a ranch designed for wt loss, they have expert trainers daily, they have motivation from team members constantly, and they are isolated from outside stresses and their jobs.

Now I realize that to sell something these days, your product has to stand out. And saying lose 2lbs/wk just isn't flashy compared to some of the claims out there (A new you in only 5min a day). But really, can anyone tell me how many times they have heard a member say they lost 12lb's in 3wks? The person has to have done it in the last 2yrs. I'm not interested in anything before that.

And in case anyone missed it above, I am stating that I think the Cheat System is a good system and that it will work. I'm just skeptical of the 4lb per week part.
Peel

Thursday, March 20, 2014, 8:52 PM

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Peel out, we wouldn't have put it there if people hadn't actually done it. Is it typical, no. If you're 130, you will not get to 118 in 3 weeks. But if you have a lot to lose? You sure can.

It's interesting that you're taking that assumption instead of just asking the question, especially since you've actually been a member of PEERtrainer as long as you have. Members barely post their successes here for whatever reason. But we have members. Meghan S. did. She won't post her before and after pictures but she did.

Hope you read the 400 page book so you can see how it works! Jackie

Monday, March 24, 2014, 11:04 AM

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One other thing peelout - we wrote the book because people wanted an actual plan. The cheat system diet, in it's current form available on PEERtrainer is a simple list without explanation about fitness, psychology, why we structured it and there are no 3 week plans. We explain it pretty in depth, but if you're looking for current members, they didn't do our actual plan. All of our success stories (Which there are tons and tons of them) followed a variation of the cheat system on its own. We are lucky to have the best partners to combine with the PEERtrainer weight loss lab. I'm not sure if you know that we've had 60,000,000 unique visitors over the last 9 years use PEERtrainer for something or other, whether it's looking up calories or using a log or reading our articles. I've personally read the emails and the issues withc actually following thorugh. No diet works unless you'll actually do it. Being obsessed with the question - what will people actually do - vs. our info is best - is what has made the Cheat System Diet so popular and actually welcomed. Everyone has learned from each other here and we married that to the science. It's been a very cool process. Jackie

Monday, March 24, 2014, 11:19 AM

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Thanks Jackie. I always appreciate feedback. Thats how we learn.

By the way, my comments on this thread are meant to be provocative. Asking a plain vanilla question like "Has anyone lost 4lbs on the cheat system?" would probably not get a very strong response (like yours). Asking a question that challenges someone elses view point gets a much stronger response that challenges the view point I issued. I despise plain vanilla.

Monday, March 24, 2014, 11:43 AM

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You've started one of the most interesting threads as of late! As soon as I heard about it in a group, I had to come visit. -- Jackie

Monday, March 24, 2014, 12:04 PM

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Thanks.
As long as everyone (me included) is open to their ability to be wrong, debate is extremely fun and educational.


Monday, March 24, 2014, 2:20 PM

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3 ways we defeat ourselves

I liked this. TCB posted it on PNP and I'm copying it here.

There are 3 things we tell ourselves that defeat us. 1 is rationalizing- things like its a birthday or holiday or lluncheon or other things we say are ok to pig out when we could find a reason every day if we let that get out of hand. 2- unrealistic expectations or goals like I will lose 20lbs and go to the gym every day in 2 weeks. when we fail, we give up. 3- all or nothing thinking- if we arent perfect we just say oh well might as well eat since I screwed up. Every moment is a new start.

Tuesday, March 25, 2014, 1:12 PM

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Thanks for reposting the above - I love that.

Friday, March 28, 2014, 2:09 PM

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Hey Mr. Peel- still off cigs??!!!

Friday, March 28, 2014, 2:10 PM

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yes

Still getting urges. Once the mind been given a chemical dependency, it never forgets it. The desire will always be there. You can only control it and program the mind so that the urges become weaker and less frequent.

Chemical dependency is a very interesting topic. I've read several autobiographies about alcoholics. Read up on alcoholism and you will understand why I don't believe overeating is an addiction. There are criteria for something to be labeled an addiction, and I don't believe overeating qualifies as an addiction. Its debatable, but it comes down to degree. I mean, we use the term "addicted" for everything these days. An addiction is when something is in total control of your life. For a smoker or alcoholic, you are thinking and planning your day around your drug of choice. If a 3hr meeting is planned, the smokers mind will instantly calculate the timing of the cigs prior to the meeting, the length of any breaks in the meeting, and the likelihood of leaving the meeting early. A smokers entire waking time revolves around getting the fix. An overeater on the other hand will have periods of wanting, such as at bed time. A smoker will go outside in the winter and stand in the rain with the flu just to get a fix. An overeater may occassionally travel for a treat, but not to the same extent. So I would argue that to say overeating is an addiction is to say that everything that we want is an addiction.
I know popcorn w/ butter and a large soda at the movies is not good for me. I always have it though. So I must be addicted.
When I've been working out regularly, if I skip a workout, I feel down. I must be addicted to w/o's.
So is everything that is bad for me but I do anyway an addiction? If you disagree with me and believe overeating is an addiction, then give me your definition of addiction and why you believe overeating is an addiction.

And please don't tell me "numerous studies and the vast majority of scientists" line. I can show multiple times where studies at the time showed something and was then discovered not to be correct years later. Tell me your reasoning as to why you believe it.

As always, I am the first to admit my ability to be wrong so you will never hurt my feelings by stating you think I am wrong.
Peel

Friday, March 28, 2014, 3:20 PM

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I pretty much agree with you. I guess the alcoholic"gene" is debatable...I don't think you are "destined" by what your parents did/do. I do see your point about smokers vs. over eaters, however, some over eaters will actually go into their trash for food. Congrats on not smoking -I've lost a couple friends to lung cancer. You are re-training your brain to not be dependent and it will get easier over time. Interesting thread - sounds like you'd make a good politician.

Friday, March 28, 2014, 4:32 PM

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Thanks but I'd make a lousy politician. I'm honest.

Which brings up an interesting topic. Name a politician you believe has/had high moral integrity. By more integrity, I mean he was honest, faithful to his wife, was not involved in any "ethics lapses" (politico speak for crimes), and just basically the kind of nice guy you would want your daughter to marry. Just shift the tense of the sex if your choice is a woman. And by moral, I don't mean they have to have conservative views.

There are only 2 I can think of: Jimmy Carter and John McCann. Lots of people didn't like Carter as president but I've never heard anyone say he wasn't a morally upstanding person. I mean, who could have made lots of money after being president, but he spends his time building houses for the poor. You won't find many politicians who do something like that.

I don't know much about John McCann but he doesn't vote the party line. He votes the way he sees it. Any politician who believes his own party is right 100% of the time is not being honest w/ himself. McCann votes the way he believe is right. As far as I know, he's been a good husband. I like that. I have no patience for bad husbands. I won't have anything to do w/ them.

So anyone got any thoughts?

Saturday, March 29, 2014, 11:47 AM

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The undisputed dumbest web site ever.

I don't normally post links, but while researching smoking (I'm closing in on 1 month of freedom from nicotene), I came across the following site:
http://www.smokingfeelsgood.com/
Check out the site. If you don't believe its the absolute stupidist site ever, let me know what you think is worse.

Heres the mission statement copied from the site:

Mission:
To educate and provide practical information on the pleasures of smoking.
Provide an online community for those who love to smoke.
Thwart the anti-pleasure establishment by showing that people really do enjoy smoking.

Here are some of the featured articles:
Smoking F.A.Q.
How to Start Smoking
Tips: How to get the most out of smoking.

I've seen some far left and far right political sites that come close, but this one takes the prize.

Monday, March 31, 2014, 8:11 PM

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McCain is a good man but he lost his way a bit during the campaign - howabout his running mate? Carter is using his influence to help people now. As far as that website- holy sh@@- that's like teenagers encouraging people to kill themselves- wtf???

Tuesday, April 01, 2014, 2:53 PM

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Hey, I'm with you all the way on what you said about McCain, losing his way, and his running mate. You are dead on there. Its unfortunate that good man and good politician don't go together.


Tuesday, April 01, 2014, 5:25 PM

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Is Peertrainer vulnerable to heartbleed

I'm not too computer savvy. Has PT looked into heartbleed and do I need to change my password if PT is vulvnearable?

Tuesday, April 15, 2014, 12:35 PM

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